Please continue discussion from Software Issues in Sri Lanka Part 7, on this thread. This thread is devoted to diverse software issues discussed in the context of Sri Lanka. Please stick to the topic and keep the discussion civil.
Previous discussion is archived in the following threads:
223 Comments
Sandhya Herath
It is high time the discussion is taken to a broader level. Standardisation of Sinhala is not the only software issue we face.
There are so many other issues, such as the challenges in marketing products and services, high HR costs (higher even compared to India), strict labour regulations (specially when it comes to call centres), lack of infrastructure facilities and last but not the least, how the current security and economic issues affects the software industry.
One key question why I like to pose is why only extremely few software companies ever succeeded in Sri Lanka? How many success we have? Aren’t the failures 20-30 times more than the successes? Why such a high rate of failures? Any idea?
Donald Gaminitillake
Sandhya your are correct
We got to think in two tires
First the International – English
Second Local – Sinhala Tamil and English (tri lingual)
I will talk on the second issue which is more acute.
In India the English education was not interrupted by the Politicians. Our country not only English the Sinhala education too deteriorating. We got to correct the education path.
To develop software — students should be guided in free thinking and user friendly ways not a with mouth fed system “YES SIR” . They should be able to use a computer freely in the mother tongue
To pave way to use a computer in Sinhala and Tamil in the same platform we have to correct some errors. Unless the Errors are corrected soon there will be no IT in local language
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Dimuthu Ratnadiwakara
Yes Sandhya there are lots of failures. I think the main reason for the failures is failing to realize that technology is always changing or the high level of resistance to change in adapting the new technologies. Due to this, after sometime the companies loose their competitive edge and hence find it difficult to survive.
Also, another issue that I think important is that most of the software companies in Sri Lanka are one product companies. This makes the companies highly vulnerable to the changes in the external environment.
Thusitha Ranavana
Mr. Donald Gaminitilake,
I do not think Sinhala/Tamil in computers is that important.
We live in a globalised society where Sinhala/Tamil has no value at all. Even anyone who does not know any of these two languages can live in Colombo and do a decent job. However for anyone who does not know English, the job opportunities are extremely limited.
So it does not matter whether Sinhala or Tamil not being there in computers. Who cares?
The challenge is to teach good English to children so that they have better opportunities in the international job market. Only government jobs require Sinhala/Tamil knowledge and who is worried anymore about them?
Even in India people use local languages only to converse, that too rarely. All written work is by default done in English.
Why do you so much worry about Sinhala/Tamil? Don’t you have any other work to do?
Thusitha Ranavana
Donald Gaminitillake
Dear Thusita
Where are you living? In sri Lanka or else where?
Please read the constitution of Lanka. We have to use all three languages.
Anyway we need Sinhala and Tamil to work and live in Sri Lanka. All govt work is done in these two languages.
Unless you come over and change the constitution of Lanka.
In India they have to use HINDI plus the local language.
The Indian currency is printed using 17 different languages
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Sinhalaya
Dear All
I don’t know what Donald is talking about! What he wont is to have unique code for each and every Sighala combination like ka, ku, kai. I have calculated all the combination. it takes 3578 character space. As we know we are using 16 bit representation (65536) for Unicode. So ASCII will not allow us to use such character space to put our language and also as entity in the computer world we do not need use such space. Some people (company and institute) have taken the responsibility for this task and also they have developed and standardize the sinhala Unicode. Still sinhala unicode is developed. There are some bugs to be solved. So they will do their task. I suggest talking about the software industry more this issue. Donald will never give up. Let him to discuss him self this matter!!!!!!!!!!!!
Donald Gaminitillake
When Latin script is over 600 ad there are other languages which has gone over 10,000 characters why worry about 3578
Do you know that your 3578 is hidden inside a software called “Shaper”?
Unicode SInhala cannot stand alone with out this “shaper”.
First why not register the whole set in the SLSI.
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Sinhalaya
Dear folks
Donald never understands the issue. We do need to reply him furthermore. Let’s discuss the software issue & SWOT of the Software industry.
Sinhalaya
Telemedicine
Ane deyyane! Me mokada venne?
Is ICTA staff so dumb that they do not know the meaning of the term ‘telemedicine’? (They think opening a tele-centre at a hospital = telemedicine)
See this?
Telemedicine at the Kurunegala Teaching Hospital
19th June 2007
The Information and Communication Technology Agency’s Nenasala Project breaks new ground when it opens its first Hospital Nenasala at the Kurunegala Teaching Hospital on the 11 th of June 2007 under the patronage of the Hon. Minister of Health Promotion and Disease Prevention and Kurunegala District MP. Mr. Jayarathna Herath. This new venture has been made possible through the partnership of the ICTA with the Human Genetics Unit of the Medical Faculty University of Colombo and the Kurunegala Teaching Hospital.
(contd..)
Here is a gem of a sentence I have found in the news item.
FOR THE POOR, A HEALTHY BODY IS AN IMPORTANT ASSET AND ILL HEALTH CAN HAVE SERIOUS IMPLICATIONS TO THEIR CAPACITY FOR EARNING A LIVING.
What an intelligent observation! We never knew till you educated us!
Whatever said and done about late Prof. Sam, I do not think he would ever have passed a news item like this for press. His absence is certainly felt.
Ranjith
True and false
See following news release
http://www.icta.lk/Insidepages/News&event/190607whatsnew.asp
Donald Gaminitillake
Donald understand the issue not Sinhalaya nor the Thusitha who had come from a different planet.
Sihhalaya cannot answer why Latin script ( I wonder Sinhalaya knows the term “”LATIN”) have registered so many individual characters. There is an absolute need to register the individual characters with correct code points to develop software in IT industry.
ICTA should open another Nanasala at the IDH hospital angoda for the patients.
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Dumindu Pallewela
Donald,
I don´t know if you can remember, but I tried to explain you how sinhala unicode works some years ago in the lklug mailing list. However each time that I made a counter argument, what you gave was your standard crap answer: ¨There is an absolute need to register the individual characters with correct code points to develop software in IT industry. I am going to save my sinhala¨. I have seen you playing the same kind of trick in every blog that you comment on.
Ok, now for once more, I´m going to do it:
Take the Unicode character set as it is… lets name them *basic* characters
** (please ignore the yansaya, repaya and other joining letters for now… we´ll talk about them later. I just dont want to talk about them in here right now so that you won´t mess things up)
1) *If* there is a *standard* on how basic characters should be joined to make other (name them *composed*) characters, as in ka u = ku, etc, don´t you think all the characters except for the ones with yansaya rephaya or other joins can be created? If not why? and give me an example.
2) Don´t you think that *if* someone crated a font and *if* someone wrote a program to display those characters on the screen and *if* someone wrote a shaper to generate the composed character shapes out of the combinations of basic characters and *if* someone wrote a keyboard driver, for a given system, will this system be able to handle sinhala characters? (again all characters except for the once with yansaya rephaya and etc.) again if not why do you think so?
Now, don´t give me that ¨I am going to save my sinhala and SLSI is incorrect¨ crap again. When you first said that SLSI 1134 is incorrect, I know that you think it is, so please do not repeat the same thing over and over. Give me answers to exact questions that I asked. Please keep a technical argument only on the necessary details, when you say all other silly stuff, people get so annoyed that they tend to ignore your posts, I´m sure that´s what Harsha did…
Techno
Dear Dumindu,
This question is not directed at me, but this is my unsolicited answer.
No, as long as yansaya, repaya, rakaransaya and joint letters are not concerned, Unicode is perfect. No problem at all.
Dumindu Pallewela
Hi Techno,
I actually handcrafted this problem for Donald. But it´s great to learn that at least for now, you and I are on common grounds :)
Ok, so for you, who understands that Unicode is a doable model, The problem is with the choice of the way yansaya, rephaya and other joint letter are represented right?
First, don´t consider the linguistic or any other concerns like zwj is not in sinhala rage. Those are more about perfection. But what I want you to *see* is that Unicode can represent all the letters with yansaya and other coplex ones too… this is how:
Add the *zwj* and the to the ¨basic characters¨ (refer to the prev. post for definition — it´s my own definition, just to explain it) Remember that the ¨hal kereema¨ is already in the ¨basic characters¨.
Think of any letter that involve yansaya as yet another ¨composed character¨. For example dya — da hal kereema zwj ya, and kyo — ka hal zwj ya o and so on… these ¨basic character¨ sequences contains all the characters with yansaya. These sequences are no different from the simple sequence for ku — ka u as far as the implementation is concerned. They both can be handled fairly in the same way.
In a similar manner. rakarashaya is created as in: kra — ka hal zwj ra
rephaya as in: va(rga) — ra hal zwj ga
and other conjunctions such as: ksha — ka hal zwj sha
and the pali like *touching* letters as in: kka — ka zwj hal ka (this usage is not implemented in most of the systems as I experienced, but that´s just a improvement needed in implementations, not a problem with the standard)
So the next question to you is:
3) do you see that all the possible letters can be formed using unicode? If not give me an example.
4) if the answer to (3) is yes, then isn´t your problem about an improvement?
Well I don´t say that it is the perfect representation. But as it is now, it *works* correctly. There may be improvements that need to be done… If anything is to be changed, then if we two agree that it should happen doesn´t mean that it should happen. There is a body which has the authority (SLSI) for it, they should decide.
That improvements part is totally off my interest. The current standard works for me, so I am not interested in changing it. If you think that it should then you have to have a strong argument as for why a change is needed? And I think there is some procedure which should be followed in order to request for a improvement. That I no idea about.
Don´t curse me if I don´t reply to you if you say yes to (3) because I don´t think I have anything more to say :)
Regards.
Dumindu Pallewela
correction:
para 3 first line should be: Add the *zwj* to the ¨basic characters¨.
Techno
I do not know why you guys have to be so dumb that you never understand what a standard is.
The question is NOT forming letters, but having a proper STANDARD. So please do not repeat this rubbish once again.
You say add ZWJ to the basic characters. (Def: Take the Unicode character set as it is… lets name them *basic* characters)
But ZWJ is NOT a basic character. So are yansaya, repaya etc. These are NOT DEFINED in Unicode.
So what prevent us from adding these to the Unicode chart and complete it? (There are 49 empty spaces and we need only 6 out of it. What is the big deal?)
It is lot more easier and logical than saying these baila.
But nobody wants to touch the Sinhala Unicode chart even for a minor modification because they are dead scared. They might be thinking the ghost of someone will come into their dreams and forever haunt them if they touch the Unicode chart.
If Bangladeshis can modify their chart to include few new characters, why cannot we include ZWJ, and few more characters and end this darned debate?
Donald Gaminitillake
Answer one question
why do we have one single code point for umlaut U?
and why Latin script have registered over 600 individual characters
They too can hide most of the characters inside a “SHAPER” have few characters registered in the unicode or ISO
Same with Chinese Korean – their input method is using basic strokes but the end result is a single code point registered in their own Local Standard and unicode and ISO.
Even in Sinhala the input method of sequence of code points is correct but the end result has to be a code point registered in the SLSI.
You all mix up with the input method and the end result of the sequence.
I always talk the end result Take “KU” —- This character is hidden inside the “shaper”with a hidden code point. When shaper does not work we see “rubbish”. with a different font set we read as “garbage”.
All this happen because it will not be represented in the SLSI. We got to register all characters in the SLSI.
This is the simple reason that SINHALA is not compatible across all platforms like the Latin Script.
Why cant we meet all of you and give a presentation or I have asked Harsha to give me airtime to give a presentation for the general public.
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Dumindu Pallewela
“I do not know why you guys have to be so dumb that you never understand what a standard is.”
well, I’m totally new to computer industry… just graduated… may be you are right. :)
“The question is NOT forming letters, but having a proper STANDARD. So please do not repeat this rubbish once again.”
Hey, I don’t have anything against you. Just trying to explain what I see is right.
“But ZWJ is NOT a basic character. So are yansaya, repaya etc. These are *NOT DEFINED* in Unicode.”
Wrong on zwj!
zwj is defined in Unicode. Check the 0x200D codepoint. It is not only used by sinhala, but also by many other languages. However yansaya and repaya are not defined in Unicode. They are rather formed using other sinhala characters as I’ve mentioned above.
“The question is NOT forming letters, but having a proper STANDARD. So please do not repeat this rubbish once again.”
I told you this is not my problem. I don’t have any such requirement. Current standard works fine for me. If you think it is needed do a proper request.
“It is lot more easier and logical than saying these baila.”
I thought you were better than Donald, who says nothing but baila. Now it seems you are no good either. I tried to get the points that we agree with and the points that we do not. But This the crap you give me. Thanks!
“”If Bangladeshis can modify their chart to include few new characters, why cannot we include ZWJ, and few more characters and end this darned debate?
Of course the SLSI can. but it should be worthy if a change need be done to a standard. I’m not saying that your suggestion is not worthy. That has to be decided by SLSI.
Dumindu Pallewela
On a second note about the standards Techno, formation of yansaya, rephaya and other touching characters are defined in SLSI1134. Go get a copy and read. :)
Dumindu Pallewela
Donald,
I told you not to give me crap.
I clearly asked you to reply to two technical points and you failed to do that. That is just because you have this pre-conceived notion that Unicode is inherently wrong and that your Huge Code Chart is the only option.
Well your Huge Code Chart is a option I do agree, but there are smarter people out there who came up with a better idea. So sad you don’t make a little effort to understand what it is.
I don’t want to explain anything to you anymore when you reply to me with your standard crap replies.
All the best with your HCC. Hope you will save our Sinhala ;)
Techno
The problem of Unicode advocators is they fail to understand what the difference between a ‘standard’ and a fonts set. They create a fonts set and think it is a standard.
Dumindu, you on the other hand does not know even the difference between Unicode and SLS 1134. The very reason why we wanted a universally accepted standard was to get rid of these local standards. If you want to use SLS 1134, why Unicode at all?
You say: zwj is defined in Unicode. Check the 0×200D codepoint.
Wrong my dear friend, the Sinhala Unicode chart is only from 0DB0 to 0DFF.
Why do you want to take code points from other charts when you can so easily include zwj in Unicode chart?
Two old fools have done a mistake once and their golayaas continue to talk baila without doing anything to correct it.
Talk about Mahadenamutta and his golayas.
Sandhya Herath
I just found something interesting in my old computer.
In 2002, before ICTA, before e-Sri Lanka and everything else, there was a meeting of almost all interested parties in Sri Lanka’s IT. People were given an opportunity to view their opinions and this is what a certain gentleman (can’t remember his name. Senaratne?)has come up with. It is regarding the allocation of dot lk domain names.
(Extracts from the transcription. If I remember correctly, it was Mr. Eran Wickramaratne who chaired the session.)
[quote]
Basically I had a problem, I have lost ten million dollars on this in Sri Lanka. I wanted to launch Asia’s largest eCommerce network called Commerce On Line and I faced a few problems, but before I come to that I’d like to mention a few other things.
I wanted a domain registered called hunt.lk and spider.lk which was supposed to be a search engine which was supposed to consist of -Yahoo, Google, Infoseek, – but unfortunately I was told because it’s a generic name that it cannot be given and my question was Are you telling me that the domain spider.lk would be given to a spider and this guy goes ‘Yes’.
So I said Oh, that’s great, then I go for Hunt.lk and they say it’s supposed to go for Wildlife Conservation and I thought, look, am I on opposite direction here, because hunt.lk was supposed to be to hunt for the right search but this guy wants to give it to the Wildlife Conservation which is the exact opposite of conserving.
So these are some of the issues that came up and then when I wanted Co.lk which was Commerce on line, they refused and I have lost ten million due to that because my name servers worldwide is registered with Col and I’m big, I’m from London and I’m trying to set up a big project here in Sri Lanka but unfortunately for the last 3 years it has been dragging on and I feel if we are to go into eGovernance which I think we need it right now for example if you look at the Internet Exchange which has been implemented last year. I was harping about it 4 years ago which we needed it, but nobody listened to it.
But unfortunately after 4 years, or fortunately we have got it today. Today there are websites, there is no traffic, very good websites but they don’t know how to promote it. The reason being nobody is aware of how it should be promoted or maybe they are but they’re not implementing it. That’s one other area. So an organisation such as CINTEC and sub divisions within CINTEC needs a certain reform and I believe it’s in good hands today with Mr Eran Wickramaratne and I hope that it should and it will move ahead with that but I think this is a priority area we should look into before we move into eGovernance because it’s very large, it’s a very vast area, you go in there you have no time for mistakes, you’re going to lose, you’re going to go in for lots of trouble.
So I feel this is something that you should seriously look at because today the IT industry has dropped severely because of this. I worked with Microsoft very closely, I was in the US. I saw that rapid development. I worked in Malaysia with Mahathir Mohamed I saw the rapid development but unfortunately in Sri Lanka whereas when Hon Ranil Wickrenasinghe introduced IT way back donkeys years ago we should have been right on the top in Asia, but unfortunately it is not. The reason is the slow development and you have lot of old hats in these departments, this is one of the reasons and I don’t know whether they need a dose of Viagra to get the boost because I find it very difficult …. excuse my language..
Chair: I think we missed the point though, your point is CINTEC should be more..
Not necessarily CINTEC, let me put it this way. For example there is an Internet Committee which decides on a domain registration but when one particular person decides that this domain cannot be given, the rest of the committee ..(not audible)..so where does the Committee come in, that’s my question? Do we have guys who just stick by the law and work on it or are we just going to have yes bosses around?
Chair: I think we heard you on that stick to re-evaluate your guidance on how you approve domain names. Your second point is?
Well, basically if you’d gone through a 3 year frustration with a ten million loss after a BOI company being implemented, I’m sure you would feel because I have gone through the mill and I just didn’t want to be involved in IT in Sri Lanka. I can say I was one of the pioneers of IT in Sri Lanka since early 90s or late 80s. I worked with EastWest, I worked with some of the biggest boys here, I’m sorry I have an American accent, an American way of saying it so it might not be right
What I’m saying is we need to go into eGovernance very badly but the reason being before you move into eGovernance it’s a very vast area we shouldn’t let room for mistakes such as this and we need some sort of a reform within the Council before we move into that, that is something that I feel. Thank you
[unquote]
Have things change much during the last 5 years?
Donald Gaminitillake
First ZWJ
These are defined in unicode as “”U 2000 – U 206F General Punctuation””
You can download this chart from unicode and see it yourself.
My issue is not ZWJ or ZWNJ etc etc
Issue is the SLSI 1134 standard.
Only few characters are registered in the SLSI.
AA.Admit this fact
Rest of the characters need to represent Sinhala us hidden inside a shaper
BB.Admit this fact
In some OS “shaper” works some does not work
When it does not work we see “Rubbish” Sinhala
CC Admit this fact
Even on the same OS if we use a different font set we see “Garbage”
DD.Admit this fact
This show us that Sinhala unicode and SLSI1134 cannot stand alone without additional back up software (name as Shaper)
EE Admit this fact
Shaper contains the additional characters which are not registered with the SLSI1134
FF Admit this fact
Therefore SLSI 1134 or Sinhala unicode is incomplete registration.
We have to correct the SLSI.
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Techno
Let me present this analogy.
A normal human being (man) has two arms.
However, even if a man loses both his arms he still remains to be a man.
Current Unicode chart is like that armless man. It does not have few characters but by definition it still remains to be Sinhala Unicode chart. It works okay, but not fully functional.
Still, unlike that poor man, we can still correct this easily and make the chart complete.
Is suggesting adding few characters to current chart a crime?
Why the advocators of current Unicode gets so upset when I propose to add just SIX characters?
This is something that can be done by one e-mail. Of course I cannot write that e-mail. If the write person writes it, that will be done. Everything will be okay.
Why not do it and end this debate?
Donald Gaminitillake
One character or 1000 characters the process is First we have to correct the National SLSI
Then report this correction to unicode and ISO
This has to be done by ICTA to SLSI
Not you or me
That is why I request ICTA to come for a discussion
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Namal Amarasinghe
It seems like Dumindu Pallewela is honestly trying to get the things straight.
But he is not in right terms when he says:
“First, don’t consider the linguistic or any other concerns like zwj is not in sinhala rage. Those are more about perfection. But what I want you to *see* is that Unicode can represent all the letters with yansaya and other complex ones too… this is how:
Add the *zwj* and the to the ¨basic characters¨ (refer to the prev. post for definition — it´s my own definition, just to explain it) Remember that the ¨hal kereema¨ is already in the ¨basic characters¨. ”
Duminda,
zwj (U 200C ZERO WIDTH NON-JOINER [ZWNJ] and U 200D ZERO WIDTH JOINER [ZWJ]) are a kind of “work a round’s” introduced to Unicode specifically for stylistic and formatting purpose.
So it is not an intelligent design/standard decision to make the basic language features (if you consider yansaya and rakaransaya as basic language features that is) to depend on this kind of supporting workarounds.
And to the dismay of our super intelligent IT fathers, then came the bugzilla:
1.There are issues when you use zwj in certain ways (identifiers). Industry did not like cross script characters identifiers. Networks can restrict the use of zwj.
2.And then the performance consideration. It is obvious that when you 3 words where you can use 2 words it becomes inefficient. There are certain things in engineering that you have to be simple as much as possible to be smart.
(See http://www.unicode.org/review/pr-96.html for further information)
Ok these issues will be fixed some day, yes that is some day in future! But that is not the question here.
Is the current standard – the one took 20 some years of research and development to come up with, the one on which government spend 600 million to develop (I don’t know see LankaeNews for the figure) – a credible optimal smart solution?
After all “works some how” is not good enough for engineering standards. Yes it may be ok for some software implementation.
Namal Amarasinghe
Sorry I forgot to mention. I am not saying that current unicode is a total crap and go back re invent the wheel or follow Donald’s solution or some thing. What I am saying is it has bugs/issues and has to be fixed, not just nice to have enhancements as Dumindu says.
It is some times ok to have bugs in a software that we can live with, but it is not ok to have even a slight bug in a fundamental standard (on which whole singhala communities future data/information systems are going to build upon- if I may exaggerate a little).
We are practically experiencing these issues.
For example I am writing a Blog in singhala.
http://namalamarasinghe.wordpress.com/
I am getting mails from people saying I cant see this and I cant see that. (Yes they have XP sp2 and fonts.lk installed)
=========================================================
Ha ha! This is a cheesy publicity stunt for my blog guys!!
Techno
I think Namal Amarasinghe is spot on.
There is a minor bug in current Unicode chart, which can be so easily corrected.
We do not need Donald’s 1660 Character allocation tables. We do not want to bin any of the work so far done. It wont affect any commercial developments done so far.
It is as simple as adding six more charters to the present chart. There are already 49 empty spaces. What is the problem of getting 6 out of this 49?
This can be done by one e-mail. If the Sri Lanka authorities send that e-mail Unicode consortium will do it immediately.
I volunteer even to write that e-mail (for free!) and also promise to mange any follow up correspondence if you are ready to take that decision.
I do not want any patents, and royalties whatever.
Unicode advocators, what do you select?
(a) Please do this minor correction and silence Donald forever.
(b) Go on debating with Donald for another 10-20 or even 30 years (till he joins Prof.)
Choice is yours.
Namal Amarasinghe
But there is one ghost roaming around the Sri Lankas ICT blocks!!
Saying that:
Dot LK kudu keewee api ekataaaa
“Samsung”lagen pen beewee api ekataaaa
atha thibbothin Unicoodeta maa nethi witaka
Mirikanawa thoge botuwath walenuth negita
ඩොට් lk කුඩු කෑවේ අපි එකට
“Samsung”ලගෙන් පැන් බීවේ අපි එකට
අත තබ්බොතින් යුනිකෝඩෙට මා නැතිවිටක
මිරිකනවා තොගෙ බොටුව මා වලෙනුත් නැගිට
Booohooo!!!!!!!!!!!
Donald Gaminitillake
At last Namal writes the truth.
Techno writes the truth but he is worried on the money spent so far on the wrong track
Other than apple where there was data was forward compatible most of the other software was rewritten.
No one can change the SLSI by sending an Email or letter.
There is a process to do. They will have to open the SLSI 1134 objection report and accept those facts then move forward.
Who filed the objections — It was DONALD and Sri Lanka association of printers where Donald is a member.
ICTA will have to accept the Error and correct it as soon as possible under my guidance
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Techno
Namal,
[quote]
I am not saying that current unicode is a total crap and go back re invent the wheel or follow Donald’s solution or some thing. What I am saying is it has bugs/issues and has to be fixed, not just nice to have enhancements as Dumindu says.
[unquote]
I 100% agree with you. This is exactly my stance. Current Unicode is definitely a workable solution but needs improvement.
Donald,
For god’s sake man, please leave me alone. I am not worried about SLS 1134 or whatever. It is a local standard. The sole purpose of having a Unicode standard is to get rid of local standard.
If I can get Unicode chart corrected (modified is a better word) I am not worried about SLS 1134.
Donald, please do not make me a part of your stupid campaign. Thanks.
samarajiva
Looks like someone can make some money on developing a mechanism to type in Sinhala:
http://www.indi.ca/2007/06/sinhala-phonetic-typing-tender/
Donald Gaminitillake
Techno why don’t you understand that Unicode Sinhala equals to the ISO 10646 equal to the SLSI 1134.
If you want to change the ISO or Unicode you got to solve it within Sri Lanka at SLSI
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Donald Gaminitillake
Dr Samarajiva
thanks for the site unless the SLSI 1134 is corrected with all he sinhala characters no IME will work. no e-dics no compatible Sinhala across all platforms. Nothing
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Techno
Donald,
First get your facts right.
Unicode standard is one thing SLS 1134 is something else.
The singular reason to have Unicode standard (Unicode = Universal-code) is to get rid of all local standards.
The singular reason why our people have SLS 1134 was because Unicode standard was incomplete. It never even mentioned about Yansaya, repaya and joint characters. So our people created SLS 1134 as a rejoinder. (Oona Pooranaya)
Having a local standard is against the very concept behind Unicode.
I am not worried about local standards. Correct the universal standard first. That is what matters.
For example, if a font developer in India or USA creates a fonts set that will not include yansaya, rapeya and joint characters but still be called ‘Unicode complaint’. Prevent that happening.
Techno
Donald,
First please get your facts right.
Unicode standard is one thing SLS 1134 is something else.
The singular reason to have Unicode standard (Unicode = Universal-code) is to get rid of all local standards.
The singular reason why our people have SLS 1134 was because Unicode standard was incomplete. It never even mentioned about Yansaya, repaya and joint characters. So our people created SLS 1134 as a rejoinder. (Oona Pooranaya)
Having a local standard is against the very concept behind Unicode.
I am not worried about local standards. Correct the universal standard first. That is what matters.
For example, if a font developer in India or USA creates a fonts set that will not include yansaya, rapeya and joint characters but still be called ‘Unicode complaint’. Prevent that happening.
Prasanna Jayamanna
Dear Donald
You have asked several good people to kick the buckets. Now we wonna ask you (warest) the same question. plz Donald Kick the Bucket!!!!!
We know about you and your work area. at the same time now we can understand to whom you are working for!
Dear donald get loss
What you have done so for we can read here. all the blogs you have done we read, and finally we agree to ask you to make suicide.
dear donald plz make suicide.
Prasanna Jayamanna, Colombo 2.
Noname (I am not donald gamini)
Yes prasanna
you are correct. donald is a Pissek. ignore him and do all your work. dont weast your time and money.
Donald Pissa.
PISSU DONALD
Donald Gaminitillake
Quote
We know about you and your work area. at the same time now we can understand to whom you are working for!
Unquote
Why not publish in this site for everyone to see.
Answer the technical question posted in the site. Come for a public TV debate.
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Mahadanamuttha
I partially agree with Donald’s solution for the Sinhala Unicode issue. To expertise, it is not the perfect solution (though even it is close). Recently, I have discovered a new solution which solves all the issues related to Sinhala Language IT implementations. Right now, I don’t want to broadcast my solution yet, since I am awaiting for the patent for my invention. Briefly, my solution is to have a unique code for each Sinhala word. This is much better and cleverer than the Donald’s solution. I have created the MahaDanaMuttha Word Allocation Table (MWAT), no body has ever thought of.
Mahadanamuttha
I partially agree with Donald’s solution for the Sinhala Unicode issue. However, it is not the perfect solution (though even it is close). Recently, I have discovered a new solution which solves all the issues related to Sinhala Language IT implementations. Right now, I don’t want to broadcast my solution yet, since I am awaiting for the patent for my invention. Briefly, my solution is to have a unique code for each Sinhala word. This is much better and cleverer than the Donald’s solution. I have created the MahaDanaMuttha Word Allocation Table (MWAT), no body has ever thought of.
Donald Gaminitillake
For MWAT to work each character has to be given a code point then MWAT will work and we all need one to back the system – MWAT equals to e-dic
So there will be several MWAT’s depending on the subjects.
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Donald Gaminitillake
http://www.ucsc.cmb.ac.lk/ltrl/services/feconverter/?maps=s_k-u.xml
in a different blog they talk about the above site (see 31)
The Sinhala we get can be seen on the following link
http://www.akuru.org/images/kumana dumriya4.jpg
Is this our Sinhala??? Just rubbish!!!!
If unicode SInhala and SLSI 1134 is correct why we see such funny Sinhala???
Above ucsc site uses the govt emblem too!!!!
Please admit your errors and correct the SLSI 1134 as soon as possible.
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Mahadanamuttha
Donald,
This is not a e-dic. Some old Sinhala words can not be represented with your solution. Eg. BrahmaDatta (In this case, tt has two bendi letters not hal th). That is why I am saying your solution is not complete.
Donald Gaminitillake
In my suggested system anyone can propose a missing character or /s and that could be added in a simple version up. There is enough space available. Hope you had seen my ISBN 955-98975-0-0 if not send me your address I will send a compliment copy.
I checked the list I have given a “”temp”” code point in the ISBN as 3547 it is already there.
Not only these Badhi characters I have given two rows for Prof JB’s Sinhala.
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Donald Gaminitillake
I forgot to add one more comment
Using my proposed system there is no “mata wadaya”
If someone want to use only “hela” or “elu hodiya” he can select that option and all characters registered under “elu hodiya” will be given access over others
Likewise it will be the same if someone wants to use “Sammatha Sinhala” character set.
You also will be able to mix all three language characters in the same (Sinhala , English . Tamil) sentence. The default system fonts will render all these.
The Font developers too can make their own fonts based on my table. All this will be published properly when I am invited to perform and the product is out.
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Donald Gaminitillake
Interesting quote from site listed in 31
Quote
P.S > But I can assure you that if you put 7 days (14 days maximum) to get used to Wijesekera layout after that it’s just a piece of cake. Why? Because Sinhala has too many characters, more than you can phonetically place on English keyboard. In the long run and when it comes to more complex use Wijesekera layout is the best. That’s why almost all the people who actually use computers for daily writing in Sinhala chose wijesekera layout :-)
Unquote
The person whoever wrote the above comment has never seen an IME working. QWERTY keyboard is enough to represent all the sinhala characters.
I talk of proper SLSI then the developers could do an IME other could make e-dic etc
When people live in a well like the frogs How come we develop IT in Sri Lanka!!!
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Dr Ravi Jayawardene
Reading thro the thread of information, it is now clear how much this site is spreading half truths.
For Instance “Telemedicine” has quoted bit and pieces of information from a laudable initiative laucnhed by ICT Agency (ICTA), to make available clinical genetic infor through a tele centre. Why not quote the entire New release…
QUOTE
The significance of this latest ICTA initiative is that it opens up new opportunities in healthcare for remote rural communities. For the poor, a healthy body is an important asset and ill health can have serious implications to their capacity for earning a living. Yet, providing quality healthcare to the vast majority of the poor living in remote rural areas is a significant challenge.
One of the many ways in which ICT can facilitate health care is through remote consultation, diagnosis, and treatment through telemedicine. An inconceivable phenomenon not too long ago, it is now a fast growing reality; a patient in a remote rural area being able to obtain expert advice from a specialist in Colombo without having to move out of his local environment is an extraordinary development. Although it has yet to bring a paradigm shift in the delivery of healthcare services, increasing sophistication in supporting technologies such as telecommunication, mobile monitoring devices etc has made telemedicine systems much more potent than ever before.
This initiative of the ICT Agency seeks to take the dividends of the highly specialized field of Human Genetics to rural communities through an ICT platform and draws on the infrastructure facilities of the newest Nenasala at the Kurunegala Hospital and that of the Koslanda Nenasala.
There are thousands of disorders caused by genetic defects, some of which are very rare, while others such as Thalassaemia are common and affect a large number of people. Taken as a whole, the number of people affected by genetic disorders is quite significant and comprises a sizeable percentage of the population. Since these conditions cause long term disability, the effect on the economy of the country due to the drain on health care and social services is enormous. For instance, the treatment of Thalassaemia alone takes up 5% of the country’s healthcare budget. When a genetic condition affects a family, it usually affects more than one member. Occasionally entire communities are affected by such disorders, as is in the case of Thalassaemia which is highly prevalent in the Wayamba Province. Since no cure is available for these disorders the only way to reduce the burden of such disorders to the country’s social and economic infrastructure is to provide appropriate counseling to affected families on management of the disease and thus prevent transmission of the condition to future generations. Proper medical advice and guidance also enable such families to better understand their condition and try to live as productive a life as possible.
There is only one centre in Sri Lanka providing such clinical genetic services, the Human Genetics Unit of the Faculty of Medicine, University of Colombo. It isn’t possible for everyone to come to Colombo to seek their advice, especially because some of the people affected with genetic disorders are disabled and cannot travel far. The development of an islandwide network of Nenasalas equipped with ICT infrastructure and broadband connectivity has opened up an array of opportunities in the field of healthcare. The Human Genetics Unit, Faculty of Medicine, Colombo can now be contacted online without the need to come to Colombo for a physical examination. This telegenetic project, which is probably the only one of its kind in the world, is aimed at giving the opportunity to remote communities to get the best genetic advice available in the country, which is on par with that anywhere in the world, via videoconferencing with the clinical geneticists in the Human Genetics Unit; Prof. Rohan W Jayasekara, Dr. Vajira H. W. Dissanayake and Dr. Prabha Mallawarachchi.
The pilot programme of this project involves online consultations with patients of the Kurunegala Teaching Hospital and the Koslanda District Hospital and will be coordinated through the Kurunegala Hospital Nenasala and the Koslanda Nenasala.
UNQUOTE
Ankuraya
Please see the ongoing discussions at this link. (Sinhala Unicode group)
http://tinyurl.com/2u2yu9
It proves that Sinhala Unicode is still not a standard and different people use different methods to represent same character within systems which claim Unicode compliant.
So Donald is correct after all…
Donald Gaminitillake
Thanks Ankuraya for writing the truth.
The reason is only a few or limited number of characters are registered in Sinhala unicode or the SLSI 1134 or ISO 10646 (all are the same)
Rest of the characters which represent Sinhala has not been registered at any level. All are hidden inside a carpet program called “shaper”. Different groups keeps these characters under different code points. That is why we see “garbage” Sinhala.
I want you all to join me to make this voice louder and to make the SLSI 1134 corrected.
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
From another site
http://www.sinhalaunicode.org/info0.php?xi=131&xs=සිංහල
සිංහල යුනිකෝඩ් ප්රමිතිය සමිමතයක් බවට පත්වීම
Making Sinhala Unicode Standard a Community Standard
සිංහල යුනිකෝඩ් ප්රමිතිය සමිමතයක් බවට පත්වීම සිංහලෙන් වැඩ කරන අප ලද භාග්යක්. ඉන් සිංහල බස විශ්ව භාෂාවක් ලෙස ජාත්යන්තර පිලිගැනීමකටද ලක්ව ඇත.
සිද්ධි රස්තු
පළමුව 21 වැනි සිය වසදී විශ්ව බසක් ලෙස පිලිගැනුණු සිංහල බස එතනට ගෙන එන්නට යුනිකොඩ් ප්රමිතිය සැකසූ, තාක්ෂණ්ය දියුණු කල සැම දෙනට අපගේ @ගෘරවය
සිංහල යුනිකෝඩ් ප්රමිතිය සමිමතයක් බවට පත්වීම සිංහලෙන් වැඩ කරන අප ලද භාග්යක්. ඉන් සිංහල බස විශ්ව භාෂාවක් ලෙස ජාත්යන්තර පිලිගැනීමකටද ලක්ව ඇත. මේ සමගම අපට මුහඋණ දෙන්නට සිදුවන ප්රධාන අභියෝගය නම් ජනතාව අතර සිංහල යුනිකෝඩ් භාවිතය ප්රචලිත කිරීමය. මේ සඳහා ප්රායෝගික වැඩ පිළිවෙලකට මුල පිරීම ඉන් ප්රධානය.
එම වැඩ පිළවෙල සැකසීමේදී ජන සහභාගීත්වය ඉතාම වැදගත්ය. ඒ සඳහා යුනිකෝඩ් ප්රමිතිය පිළිබඳව සියල්ලන් දැනුවත් කිරීම, රාජ්ය කටයුතු හා ජන සන්නිවේදනය කෙරහි යුනිකෝඩ් ප්රමිතිය ආරෝපණය කිරම, අළුත් සිංහල මෘදුකාංග දියුණු කිරීම, අළුත් අකුරු
වැල් නිරමාණය, පැරණි ලේඛණ හා දත්ත සිංහල යුනිකෝඩ් ගත කිරීම, නව ලේඛණ යුනිකෝඩ් මගින් සැකසීමට දිරි දීම මෙහිලා වැදගත් වේ. වසර 14 ක් පමණ විවිධ ප්රමිතීන් වල වැඩ කරන්නන් යුනිකෝඩ් ප්රමිතියට හුරු කරවීම හුදෙක් පුහුණුව සහ මෙවලම් පමණක් නොව ආකල්පවල වෙනසක් කිරීම අවශ්ය වේ.
යුනිකෝඩ් ප්රමිතිය දේශයක් වශයෙන් අපට විශාල මුදල් ප්රමාණයක් හා කාළයක් ඉතිරි කරනු ඇත. එය අප විසින් අනිවාර්යෙන්ම ඉදිකළ යුතු තාක්ෂණ අත්තිවාරමකි.
මෙහිදී අනිවාර්යෙන්ම සාමාන්ය ජනතාවගේ එදිනෙදා භාෂා අවශ්යතාවයන්ද, අධ්යාපනය හා රාජ්ය කටයුතුද, බැංකු හා පුද්ගලික
අංශයේ සන්නිවේදනයන් කෙරෙහි සැලකිලිමත් විය යුතු සේම
රාජ්ය අනුග්රහය සේම දේශපාලන නායකත්වක්ද අනිවාර්ය වේ. මේ සඳහා දීප ව්යාප්ත වැඩ පිළවෙලකට අනුග්රහය ලැබීම වැදගත්ය.
සිංහල යුනිකෝඩ් ප්රමිතිය හා විවෘත මුදුකාංග කෙරෙහි කරන ආයෝජනයන් ප්රායෝගික හා ජනසෙත උදෙසා කරන්නක් වීම ඉතා වැදගත්. ජනමාධ්ය කරුවන්, අන්තර්ජාල ප්රකාශකයන්, රජයේ කාර්යාල, පාසැල් සිසුන්, විධායකයින්, පොත් සහ පුවත්පත් ප්රකාශකයන්ගේ විවිධ අවශ්යතා සහ වෙනස් කම් පිළිබඳ අවබොධයකින් මේ සඳහා කැපවීම වැදගත්.
අනිවාර්යෙන්ම මෙම වැඩ පිලිවෙල දීප ව්යාප්ත කඩිනම් වැඩ පිළිවෙලක් විය යුතුය. රාජ්ය පරිපාලන, අධ්යාපන, ජනාධිපති, අගමැති,
දිසා ලේකම්, ප්රාදේශීය ලේකම් කාර්යාලද නැණසල හා පාසැල්ද ප්රථම අදියර තුල සිංහල යුනිකෝඩ් භාවිතය සඳහා ආරෝපණය කල යුතුය. එක් එක් ආයතන වල අවම වශයෙන් සිංහල යුනිකෝඩ පුහුණුව ඇති අය තිදෙනකුවත් සිටීම අනිවාර්ය වේ.
සෑම ආයතනයක්ම ඒ සඳහා අවශ්ය මුදුකාංග සහ තාක්ෂණික සහය ලබා ගැනීමට පහසුකමි සැලසිය යුතු අතර, නව තාක්ෂණය හා ප්රචාරණ ක්රම වේදයන් යොදාගත යුතුය. උපක්රමශීලි ලෙස සැම සහයෝගය ලබාගත යුතුය. මේ සඳහා ජාතික ප්රමුඛතාවයක් ලබාදී පහසුකම් නොඅඩුව සැපයීම වැදගත්.
සාමාන්ය ජනයා වෙත යුනිකෝඩ් ආරොපණය කිරීමෙදී දැනටමත් ඔවුන් භාවිතා කරන අකුරුවැල් හා විවිධ යතුරු ක්රම පිළිබඳව සෙනේහයෙන් බලා, අවසාන ප්රතිපලය යුනිකෝඩ් වන පරිදි එවන් අකුරු වැල් වලින් නිර්මිත ලේඛණ යුනිකෝඩ් වලට හැරවීමෙ මෙවලම්ද ලභාදිය යුතුය. කිසිවක් අතහරින්නට බල නොකල යුතුවා සේම, යුනිකෝඩ්
වලට මග පෑදු විවිධ තාක්ෂණයන්ට නිගා නොකල යුතුය.
අපට අවශ්ය වන්නේ යුනිකෝඩ් පිළිබඳ ජාතික සම්මුතියකට මග පෑදීමය. ලංකාවේ අදත් නිවාස සැලසුම් අඳින්නේ අඩි අඟල් වලිනි. කොලඹ සිට මහනුවරට සැතපුම් 72 කි. නමුත් තියෙන්නේ කිලෝ මීටර් කණුය. අළුත් ගීත ආවාට පරණ තැටි ගීත තාම ජනප්රියය.
ප්රායෝගික තත්වය අවබෝධයෙන් මහපොළව මත සිටිමින් මේ වැඩ පිලිවෙල ක්රියාත්මක කරන්නට උත්සාහ ගත යුතුය. අළුත් ශ්රී ලංකාවක මග එයයි.
සිංහල යුනිකෝඩ් අන්තර්ජාලයේ ස්තාපිත කිරීමට සියලුම රජයේ වෙබ්
අඩවි සිංහල යුනිකෝඩ් භාවිතා කිරීමට අනිවාර්ය වන පරිදි දින නියම කල වැඩ පිළිවෙලක අවශ්ය වේ. අන්තර්ජාල පුවත් ආයතන සිංහල යුනිකෝඩ් භාවිතයට දිරිදීම සඳහා මෙවලම් හා පුහුණුව ලබාදෙන දිරිගැනවීම් වැඩ පිලිවෙලක් ආරම්භ කල යුතුය.
ජනමාධ්ය වේදීන්ට අන්තර්ජාලයේ නිදහස් ප්රකාශණ පහසුකමක් සලසා
දෙමින් සිංහල යුනිකෝඩ් භාවිතය ජනප්රිය කල යුතුය. සිංහල යුනිකෝඩ් ස්තාපනයේදී අපට පාඩම් ඉගන ගත හැකි හොඳම උදාහරණය නම් 1978 පමණ ක්රියාත්මක කල මෙට්රික්කරණ වැඩ පිළිවෙලයි. අප රාත්තල් වලින් කිලෝග්රෑම් වලටද, අඟල් වලින් සෙන්ටිමීටරයටද, ගැළුමෙන් ලීටරයටද පහසුවෙන් මාරු වූයේ ඉතා පහසුවෙනි. මිනින්දෝරු, වාරිමාර්ග, මහාමාර්ග, ඉංජිනේරු, ගණිත,
විද්යා වැනි හැම විෂයක්ම වෙනස් වුයේ තාක්ෂණය හා ආකල්පන් සමගිනි.
මෙයත් එවැනි වැඩ පිළිවෙලකි. තාක්ෂණය හා ආකල්ප සමගින් අපද වෙනස් විය යුතු බව මගේ නිහතමානී අදහසයි.
නිරංජන් මීගම්මන
කපුටා.com
niranjan 2006-08-27 11:57:00 (52)
Donald Gaminitillake
Dear Niranjan
Please see the following text
http://www.akuru.org/images/quote47.jpg
This is what we see as Sinhala.
This is not Sinhala. TSinhala to be a universe language it has to be seen on any computer without any problem. These are not bugs but because of incomplete nature of the SLSI 1134 and Sinhala unicode.
we have to correct this error. Error done by the late professor.
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Munupura
Donald seeye,
If you are so concerned about Sinhala, why do you always write in English?
Isn’t it time for your to shift to your mother tounge and show everyone else your non-Unicode superior product to the world?
Donald Gaminitillake
I write in English because Sinhala is not compatible across all platforms.
Cant you see the Link No 48. There is no IME for Sinhala. The SLSI1134 is incomplete.
Once all these are corrected not only I but you too will be able to just talk to the computer in Sinhala and the text will flow.
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Munupura
Donald seeye,
[quote]
I write in English because Sinhala is not compatible across all platforms.
[unquote]
This is like a 2 year old saying ‘Why should I learn Sinhala language, only 17 million out of the 6 billion world population knows Sinhala and I will wait till everybody in the world start speaking Sinhala to learn it’
Admit it, in spite of giving ‘pora talks’ you have not even created a single font, and probably you do not even know how to install a font set in your PC, let alone creating it.
Please go to IDM and do a basic course in computing first. You are never too old to learn.
– Munupura
සිංහලයා
නිරංජන් මීගම්මන මහත්මයා
ඔබේ සාකච්චාව ඉතා අගෙයි. අප ලාංකිකයන් ලෙස යුනි කේත ප්රචලිත කිරිමට අවැසි පසුබිම සෑදිය යුතුයි.
මා මීට පෙර ඩොනල්ට කේත 3600 පමන බාවිතයේ ඇති අපහසුව පෙන්වා දුනි. ඔහු මෙය පිලිගන්නේ නැත.
මා දන්නා ලෙස ඔහුද සිංහල ස්ථාපනය කර ගෙන ඇත. එනිසා ඔබේ අදහස් සිංහලේන්ම ලියන්න.
(බල්ලෙක් බිරුවාට කන්දක් පාත් නොවේ-ප්රස්ථාපිරුලකි)සත්ය සත්යමයි
Donald Gaminitillake
I talk about a standard not Font or set of fonts. Fonts are secondary matter
If you do not understand what is unicode and SLSI 1134 please go and learn the subject.
Please answer the technical question posted in this link
http://www.akuru.org/images/quote47.jpg
Why not come forward for a public debate
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Donald Gaminitillake
Dear Sinhalaya
Whether we have 3600 or more will not a problem to represent in computer. First we got to correct the SLSi 1134
This is the most basic step
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Munupura
Donald seeye,
Even assuming SLS 1134 is incomplete, that does not prevent you from writing in Sinhala.
If Mr. Niranjan Meegammana can write in Sinhala (and you can read it) why cannot you write in Sinhala and respect your mother tongue, which you are so eager to save?
Do not be a hypocrite. Prove your self by action.
– Your loving Munupura
Ps. Please pass my regards to achchi.
Donald Gaminitillake
Let any one writes but everyone will not be able to read what is written on 47 or 52.
For every one to read we have to use Latin script until SLSI 1134 is corrected.
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
47 and 52
To read the content in the 47 & 52 you can install sinhala Unicode. Visit http://www.fonts.lk and install
Nalin
Donald Gaminitillake
I am posting the following Email mgs sent between Prof Ruwan and self for your perusal
I am a TAX payer in Sri Lanka and a Citizen of Sri Lanka and University do have a right to answer any question posted by a contributor also to meet and discuss in public.
Sinhala is a National language of Sri Lanka and we got to protect it.
Professor clearly say that I misguide the public.
Please answer the technical question posted in this link
http://www.akuru.org/images/quote47.jpg
When we see Sinhala like the above image How can one say SLSI 1134 is correct!!!!
**********************
Certain names were deleted for privacy
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First mail was sent to BT options re my interview
i read the article on the digital divide (actually on sinhala enabling IT) in the current issue of BT with interest. i’d like to extend you an invitation to the language technology research lab at the university of colombo school of computing in case you are really interested this stuff.
ruvan weerasinghe
**************
Donald replied
************
Dear Ruwan
Why don’t you organize a Public & Press presentation. Invite all the media and I will show them the incomplete SLSI 1134 standard.Enclosing two images for you to answer. I will not accept the word “bugs”. You have to admit that the SLSI 1134 unable to stand alone without any additional back up like ‘Shaoer” Inside this “shaper” you have hid the rest of the Sinhala characters. To represent Sinhala fully you need “shaper” to be present. Even on XP this shaper does not act correctly. 25 years of public funding has gone waste inside a “shaper”. If you have corrected the SLSI with all the chracters this problem never occur. This fact was filed by me at the SLSI 1134 objection meeting. You people over ruled me and made a mess out of sinhala. There is no IME developed for Sinhala nor we can use Sinhala Tamil and English on the same document like MSword on one format set of font. Also there is no SLSI for Tamil Language nor any research done by CIntec or ICTA for Tamil.
Best
Donald Gaminitillake
*******
Ruwan’s reply
*********
Dear Donald,
Thanks for giving me the contact for Harin Fernando of Business Today.
As a matter of fact, we have done that already – i.e. had a public
launch of our Sinhala language resources and tools a few months back. I,
and then many many others, have over the past 3 years (actually more)
done our fair bit to educate the entire publishing industry (with which
incidentally we have an excellent rapport) and succeeded with the
exception of you!
While I’m very prepared to make a presentation and demonstrate how our
Sinhala tools and resources work in UNICODE, I have absolutely no
interest in extending the meaningless ‘debate’ you claim to be
championing: rough consensus and running code are fine for me.
To all those others to whom this is copied, and who may also be being
mislead by Donald, let me invite you to the UCSC for some live demo’s of
the following: (a) a Sinhala text-to-speech system, (b) a Sinhala
optical character recognition system (c) a Sinhala lexicon (d) a 10m
word Sinhala text corpus, (e) a word-level web page translator and (f) a
tool for converting most proprietary (old) fonts to Sinhala UNICODE. We
could also point to several other people’s work with Sinhala UNICODE
including websites and even a search engine.
I hope that we can all then get back to work and do something actually
*useful* for our country.
Regards,
Ruvan.
PS: In case any of you find my response not courteous enough for Donald,
please understand that some of us have had more than 3 years experience
with him. For many years several people gave him the benefit of the
doubt and tried clearing his doubts about UNICODE. After initially
dismissing UNICODE as an imperialist technology ‘poked down our
throats’, he has now come to the realization that fighting UNICODE will
not get him anywhere. So he has shifted his focus to trying to include
his scheme of things (largely derived from the Japanese character
encoding model) as Sinhala UNICODE for reasons that some of us know all
too well. Let’s wish him well with the UNICODE Consortium… which I’m
sure he has already approached on the subject (but for some unknown
reason has not got a response from?).
PPS: Donald, I know you will reply this and draw more red herrings. Let
me state clearly that I do not intend to reply any of those since I
respect the judgment of all those you’ve copied this to – I also respect
their time and am confident that they would contact me direct for any
clarifications.
————
Donald’s reply
***********
Dear All
I requested a public hearing as SLSI 1134 is incorrect and incomplete product.
I had enclosed two images to prove the incompleteness of this product
One can simulate on a close environment but Sinhala is not compatible across all platforms nor SLSI 1134 unable stand alone.
The university is dead scared not to answer the technical question posted in my mail.
I request that I need a public hearing on this subject to save Sinhala from extinction.
Best regards
Donald Gaminitillake
Mahadanamuttha
Donald,
I didn’t have any problems of viewing Sinhala letters, as you mentioned in item 48
http://www.akuru.org/images/quote47.jpg
I believe the problem is related to your montor. My advice is to replace it with a new one. Go for a Flat screen. Believe me, I am Mahadanamutta. I have solved thousands of similar problems before.
Chutta
I think Prof. Ruvan Weerasinghe has no other work than replying to mad men like Donald.
Unbiased
Dear Donald,
All these emails you exchanged are private mails and I don’t think it is ethical for you to publish them in a blog. Please stick to basic ethics. You may have a couse to fight but do it in the ethical framework.
We don’t know to whom you have copied this email as mentioned in the mail. But do not use the cc bar for the simple reason that it is there in your mail program. Fight ethically. Do not resort to gurilla attacks like this. Many people will feel embarassed in this kind of unethical acts. This is not a question of Unicode and your so-called solution. This is a question of ethics. Technology is there for people like you and me to use with a sense of responsibility.
Donald Gaminitillake
Reply to 58 there is noting wrong in the screen. This is not a screen problem or a problem in computer Some computer sees and rest see as grabage or as rubbish. This is clearly proved even in unicode consortium.
Dear 60 Sinhala SlSI 1134 is not a private issue. It is a public issue. Public should know what is happening. I have copied it to many, many as possible. At least someone will open the eyes and look into the matter with a correct vision.
I use the cc bar so that the recipient knows who gets it. If you hide the name/s bcc it is unethical. If you publish it then they all knows the facts.
What is wrong in exposing the truth? Sinhala is not compatible across all platforms simply because the SLSI 1134 is incomplete.
Accept this error and now the time is ripe to correct it.
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Ruvan Weerasinghe
Dear Donald,
At long last I realized that I was wrong all along and you are right. Let’s scrap SLSI 1134 and Sinhala UNICODE and start afresh.
Ruvan Weerasinghe
Namal Amarasinghe
It is really sad that people like Dr. Ruwan’s caliber has to deal with people like Mr. Donald. (I am comparing ONLY the the academic knowledge, experience of this two people have with respect to the issue they are fighting for) But why things are happening like this in our country.
1. People who are experienced enough to study these issue are all in agreement with Dr. Ruwan and late Prof. Sam or they don’t like to get in to this debate due to certain unknown reasons.
2. There was no proper open academic discussion on these solutions before they come to conclusions on things like SLSI 1134. (I am pretty sure that if few more sinhla scholars involved in the initial discussions, yansaya and rakaransay defineetly will have little more importance in the standard).
That is the only thing we can get out of this useless debate. Many higher up academics/policy makers do not consider any body else in this country are qualified enough to challenge them. Other than trying to make opposing voices silent, they are not ready to listen to why they oppose you. Then they use what ever the power they have to silence the opponents. When people see this happening over and over again I doubt any scholar who has many other avenues to peruse in there carrier would want to come to debate with this kind of dictators. Once this top guys lose any kind of meaning full criticism due to their this tough un-academic behavior, it is no surprise that you will have only opponents like Mr.Donald left.
Dr. Ruwan, (I don’t know may be one of the princes in Dr. Sam’s little kingdom, may be next king) I kindly request you to look at the past as an academic and try to build an open environment where people can have different ideas but still can play. That is the only responsible solution to silence people like Mr. Donald.
==========================================================
If all you have is a hammer, every problem is a nail
(They took all my other tools away from me :) But the hammer is not that bad after all, isn’t it? )
Donald Gaminitillake
Dear Namal
Thank you for your comments.
I cannot read your site correctly.
If you are in Colombo please call me.
Lets meet and discuss. I will show the error.
We got to correct this error
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Donald Gaminitillake
Namal you are doing Sinhala blog have you ever visited this blog using any other operating system?
At 45 Ankuraya
Quote
It proves that Sinhala Unicode is still not a standard and different people use different methods to represent same character within systems which claim Unicode compliant.
Unquote
The SLSI 1134 cannot stand alone without a “shaper” Also different people keep the same character on different codepoints. (the characters that has not been listed in the SLSI1134)
This is the issue I was addressing all these years. Why do you want to hide the characters?
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Sandhya Herath
This is not about Unicode/Sinhala. This is about dialogue.
Whatever Donald says is immaterial, but we should respect his right as a citizen to propose to the authorities what he feels right. The question is whether anybody would listen.
From the inception ICTA’s attitude about everything (not just this one) has been “We know all whats good for you. Don’t try to teach us, we don’t care about your opinion, we do what we want”
Why ICTA has to be so bossy?
When people complain about inflation, Central Bank not only takes measures to reduce it (at least they show so) but the Governor himself publicly answer those issues. (though you may or may not agree with it)
When people complain about transport service, healthcare service, education etc. at least the authorities show concern and the minimum pretend that they would address the issues.
Why ICTA has to be different? Is it because ICTA employees think that their salaries are paid by WB and not the public of this country? (Mind you, what WB gives is a loan, not aid)
What is the use of initiating a policy dialogue, if ICTA is never ready to listen to anyone? (spare Donald)
Why ICTA employees have to walk six inches above ground and pretend that they do not hear anyone?
If they continue to do so, I do not think people like Donald has any other means than restoring to guerilla tactics. I have seen he is doing that so many times, but I cannot blame him.
When somebody does not listen you take a hammer and hit the head of the person. May not be ethical, but what option left?
Donald Gaminitillake
Thank you Sandhya for the lovely comment
I really admire the contents
They over rules me at the SLSI public hearing and gave a product to the country
I told them incl Prof Ruwan that their path is incorrect 3 years ago
Now we see its errors
Is it because of their “ego” that they try to rule else making the public fool
We have seen the error I have a solution (correct the SLSI1134) if there is another better solution why not they publish?
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
ICTA forums
Thanks Sandhya, your views are very relevant and timely.
I also want to add this about the so called ‘ICTA forums’.
Started by Manju, the objective of having forums is to have a set of a large number of volunteers contributing for e-Sri Lanka effort. Manju had invited the right people from right organisations to have a meaningful input.
However, what had happened to these forums today is very pathetic.
ICTA forums are today dominated by few boot lickers. (like Kaputa) What they all do is to use the forums to eulogise Emperor’s new clothes. ICTA is happy listening to these petty eulogies so that they do not have to answer tough questions. I heard recently in one forum other members were thoroughly disappointed about the way Kaputa (Niranjan) tried to dominate it.
Let me ask who the people in these forums are today.
Are they the people really work on ICT4D or a set of people whose only aim is to receive 5 million grants under e-society fund?
I am not taking about strangers. Even if we take ex-employees of ICTA there is a fair number still work actively on ICT4D (Manju, Dilanthe, Helani, Shoban) Are any of these represent these forums?
No. Because their views are perceived dissident and ICTA does not want to hear any dissident views. ICTA people think they know all, others know nothing, so all they want is a set of yes men to boot lick.
Will these things ever change?
Donald Gaminitillake
Visit the following link and see the image
http://www.akuru.org/images/SinhalaJune30.jpg
Don’t you guys feel shy a Simple Sinhala like “Buddha Pujawa” cannot be written with unicode Sinhala or SLSI1134
You all talk that this is a working Solution!!!!
Do not tell it is a “BUG” This is the result of a incomplete SLSI 1134 or Sinhala Unicode
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
India aids rural 'Knowledge Centres' in Lanka
India has gifted computers, scanners and fax machines worth LKR 13 million ($1,16,906)
million to 20 of the 377 Nayasalas or “Knowledge Centres” in rural Sri Lanka.
Lalith Weeratunga, Secretary to the Sri Lankan President told Hindustan Times in Colombo on Saturday, that the Nayasalas (Gyanashalas in Sanskrit) were President Mahinda Rajapaksa’s pet scheme which he had been working on since the time he was Prime Minister.
Impressed with the increasing use of computers in rural India, Rajapaksa told Hindustan Times soon after becoming Prime Minister in 2004, that he would go to New Delhi seeking Indian aid for a similar movement in Sri Lanka.
Weeratunga said that the President had set a target of 1000 Nayasalas to be established by the end of 2008.
The 377 th. Naya Sala was inaugurated by Weeratunga and the Indian High Commissioner in Sri Lanka, Alok Prasad, on Saturday at Tissamaharama in draught-prone South Sri Lanka.
http://www.hindustantimes.com/StoryPage/StoryPage.aspx?id=2eac21bc-a501-4fc7-b577-8becb42b8e97&MatchID1=4470&TeamID1=2&TeamID2=4&MatchType1=2&SeriesID1=1111&PrimaryID=4470&Headline=India aids Lanka’s ‘Knowledge Centres’
Donald Gaminitillake
We can have 10,000 nanasala’s in Sri Lanka but if we cannot work across all platforms in Sinhala & Tamil what is the use of having them!!!!
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Wijaya Pariganaka on VK
Read Wijeya Pariganaka’s editorial on late Prof V.K. Interesting to read. But full of wrongly dedicated credits to V.K. Donald must read this.
Donald Gaminitillake
Please visit the following site
You will need a (PC running on windows) xp Computer to read the text in Sinhala.
http://www.lankaenews.com/Sinhala/news.php?id=2526
Then read the text that I have uploaded into my site Akuru — a scan copy of the text of Wijaya Pariganaka 2007 July issue. (77)
http://www.akuru.org/images/editorialjulypariganaka.jpg
Read both articles compare the text and understand the truth.
Donald Gaminitillake
Colombo
Silly girl
Thanks Donald.
I am surprised to learn (from Wijaya Priganaka) that somebody treats telecasting election results or doing graphics for cricket matches as things very important to the community.
These are not ‘vishvakarma’ tasks one should eulogise. It is an insult to late Prof. VKS if somebody treats them as his biggest achievements.
I also did not know Prof. VKS had anything to do with relasing exam results over web/mobile phones. I thought it was done by Examination dept with EWIS and Dialog. How wrong I was. Tomorrow somebody would say it was Prof. VKS who designed www and C and I am sure nobody would say otherwise.
The question one should ask is why we are still so backward in IT compared to India, our nearest neighbour with comparable socio economic conditions. Who was responsible for that ‘development’?
Correction
Pariganaka editor says Prof. S has neither been a great scientist nor a great mathematician.
This is nothing but serious mistake and an insult. Let me correct that.
Some of the greatest achievements of Prof. S had been in the field of Mathematics and Nuclear Physics, not in ICT, though it is there he built his name at a later stage.
Had Pariganaka editor done a Google scholar search he could have easily found the contribution of Prof S. to the field of Maths and Science.
Is Parganaka editor too e-illiterate or is it just showing his ignorance? Or he too in the game of attacking people who can no more defend themselves?
Take it easy
I don’t think we should take Pariganaka Editor’s comments seriously. If you guys read his editorials you may understand he is yet another Wasudewa Nanayakkara. (Cardboard Hero) He attacks all big companies like Microsoft, etc. and try to show he is a great socialist. Dhanawadaya Bhangawewa type of man. But can the industry survive without these big time investors?
Editor does nothing more than copying and pasting from English websites to the magazine. Old Pariganaka was rich in local content and addressed local issues. But what happens now is just back scratching to survive. It won’t take long for WNL to understand this foolish editor’s tom foolery and replace him with someone who has some brain and fresh ideas. A lunatic should not destroy this magazine which did a yeoman service to the field. If this lunatic continues his boot licking in this manner there will be dedicated blogs for him as well sooner than later. One should have principles to run the game. WNL management is not fools. They run the best publications in the country. Pariganaka has lost its good contributors over the years and one can read only bullshit in the magazine now. We feel sorry for the readers who can read only Sinhala. They have no option but to read this bullshit as there is no other options. If they have internet access and Sinhala content as Donald keeps stressing this editor cannot fool the readership. Magazine has started offering more prizes (like the FM radio stations and low quality TV stations do) to lure readership. But people bought this magazine in the past because it was content rich. But today the magazine is bankrupt without proper content. This is high time readers raise their voice against this cheap approach of luring them with prizes instead of content.
I'll scratch your back, you scratch mine
People like Pariganaka editor and Kaputa are following the theory of “I’ll scratch your back, you scratch mine” for their survival. These guys know that though VK is dead his henchmen are ruling the ICTA and ICT field yet. So, praising them will help the survival of these ass licking admirers. Why can’t these people count on their talents than trying to survive by scratching people’s backs? Both have talents which can be put into good use. They don’t have to betray their conscience for ‘few more rupees.’